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Royal House of Goose
Marine Mom on Media Manipulation
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Exploring the evolution of mass media with a subject matter expert or why the media is dumb, French and gay.
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Hello and welcome back to the Royal House of Goose. Today is episode five. We will be discussing the media, its evolution, and social media's impact with a good friend of mine who will be going by Marine Mom, which is also her handle on TikTok and several of the things that she works with on social media. She will get into it, I'm sure, at some point in our discussion. Remember to sign up to the Substack, the Royal House of Goose updates. Contribute any suggestions, questions, comments you may have. We will start doing quick addresses to them and short burst podcasts in between. There is a new book released called The Chamber Pot. It's a short 28-page uh let's call it a propaganda pamphlet. Effectively, it covers all the scandals and the rumors and the gossip monger that went on during our founder's time surrounding them between the uh the revolution and the proper establishment of our country. And as always, the Codex Politica is available on our hub site, which is the House of Goose. Excuse me, the Royal House of Goose, and we look forward to hearing from you. Let's get into it.
SPEAKER_03Quickly as I'm thinking, because the juice, I'm like, please, juice.
SPEAKER_00Hey y'all, we're on today with a friend of mine who goes by Marine Mom. You may know her from TikTok and uh a lot of the geopolitical analysis that she does. She's worked in media for many years, and I can't wait to poke her brain on things. How are you doing, Mariana?
SPEAKER_03Hey, love my nickname there, the Mariana. But yeah, listen, it it's good to hang out. I appreciate you inviting me over. And yeah, I'm excited about your podcast. I think it's great.
SPEAKER_00All right, so let's dive in with a little bit of standard procedure here. What uh what's your your background, if you wouldn't mind running through all the lovely credentials, real quick?
SPEAKER_03Well, of course, I spent about 30 years in media. I uh have a degree in marketing and then kind of circled back after I first went to film school actually, and then circled back and finished my marketing degree. And then later in life, circled back for my political science degree. So I wear a lot of hats. And I did that because, of course, uh government type of marketing that I was interested in, political marketing. But I spent about 30 years in media and uh wore a lot of hats. Um, I kind of started in the era, era when uh media was still very structured. You know, you had your production, you had your sales, your traffic, your marketing, your programming promotions. It was more like station marketing as well versus marketing, community events, sweeps, you know, ratings, remotes. Pretty much everything moved through real processes. And I worked around, you know, traditional sales, I worked around non-traditional revenue, station promotion and branding, programming and promotion and marketing strategy. So I saw kind of both sides. I got to see the news side because of the dual programming and marketing, how it intertwined. And also, of course, I got to see the public-facing side and the business side. So it was, it was kind of a nice dual look around that. I think uh what I what I think people miss is that media didn't just become biased one day either. It became really pressured, and that pressure came from the ratings and the ownership consolidations. So I watched all of that throughout my career and the advertising demands that we had with the shrinking newsrooms, uh, the political access, of course, that became overwhelming and really a lot of corporate messaging and the new, of course, social algorithms, right, that were laid in about honestly halfway through my career, journalism kind of used to be a product, right? And then, of course, later the attention became the product. So once the attention became the product, of course, outrage became a pretty big business model. So that's pretty much it.
SPEAKER_00I mean, that's the oldest saying in any official business, isn't it? That if you don't see the product and it's free, you are the product, whether it's your information or your, you know, your data, your face, your voice, your interests, what you like, what you shop for, whatever it may be.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean, people people thought we were selling the news. It was pretty funny. I mean, we were never selling the news, we were selling attention because because we needed the ratings.
SPEAKER_00I uh I just dropped a sub stack and I won't I won't uh rat trap you with this one, but the temptation did hit me to go into the Deldibert group and the trilateral and the CFR and then the six major conglomerates that you know bought up and consolidated. And then I realized, you know, uh you'd you'd probably uh smack me later. So if you guys want to read that, that's in the sub stack, but for now we're gonna keep it to you know just general media marketing.
SPEAKER_03And we can we can talk a little about them later.
SPEAKER_00What what are some of the marketing advertisement tricks? What are some of the liminal, subliminal, and super liminal messagings that you saw integrated into media and how has that evolved?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean, obviously things have changed a lot, right? Throughout throughout my career. You know, it used to be just really simple, you know, uh commercial messaging, right? And uh and then, you know, media quickly learned how to become a business. And it was like every single thing that was available for sale was available for sale, including, you know, you could slap a freaking, you know, sponsorship on top of a of a broadcast tower. I mean, it got it got pretty amazing actually to see kind of the creativity involved in in selling the business because that's really what it became. Um, I think, I think that for a lot of people, you know, most people don't understand that, you know, there was like old media where they had the hooks, right? The the teases, right? The uh lead-ins, the sweep packages, emotional framing. It was really about appointment viewing, right? And the urgent and scarcity. And that's kind of gone by the wayside. So now you have like this tiny window of time to actually grab somebody's attention. Again, we sell attention, somebody's very limited time to grab somebody's attention. And uh that became different. You couldn't sit it in a time block anymore, you had to start embedding it into the actual program or you had to start doing you know, advertising. Hang on, my watch is ringing. Oh, there we go. I don't know how that's happening.
SPEAKER_00Speaking of advertising, that does not go for an Apple advertisement unless they'd care to pay me.
SPEAKER_03Oops, sorry. Anyway, but anyway, but yeah, so it it actually is interesting because um, you know, you you would see all of this, uh, you know, different types, like I said, of of ads, ways to advertise, way to reach the market. And I think, you know, as like social media and we'll start with internet, because internet in general, with the creation, and I I will never forget it, the creation of banner ads, even right. Like when banner ads came into play, I mean, the whole industry was like, what the hell do we do with these? I mean, like we we we knew that we had them, nobody knew how to use them or sell them. And from a programming or or advertising standpoint, like the team would sit back and just go, What the fuck do we do with this? Right. So it was it was kind of a very strange scenario. And you know, over time we had to create an industry or a governing board, if you will, because you know, you had the IAB that came out later and uh to oversee it, and they still do a crappy job. But but we had no real means, there was no precedent. Do you know what I mean? So it was almost embarrassing where they would say, okay, hey, take this, use this, and spend, I don't know, like uh say it's gonna cost you a thousand dollars, you're gonna have it up for a month, and we have no idea how to even measure it. So I I'm I'm kind of old in that sense, where I've seen like the dawn of the use of even online marketing being used to now where we are today, which is a huge, huge difference. And I think, you know, when we're talking about tips and tricks, because that's such a hard thing to come by, I would say, you know, marketing is not just ads, right? The industry has changed a lot. Marketing is framing, it's repetition. It's really important. I always call it the the three, the three R's, right? The right message to the right audience the right number of times. Like that is quite literally the marketing formula. I'll repeat it. The right message to the right audience the right number of times.
SPEAKER_00Pretty sure the CIA called that psychic driving, but whatever.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so it's all about timing, it's about emotional association and controlling what the audience thinks, right? Or or something means, right? And of course, that's where it can become also dangerous, right? So I think the first trick is the framing, right? So we talked about framing here. So the first trick is you can make the same fact feel different depending on the word around it, right? Like protest is also a riot, it's also demonstration or insurrection, like it's gonna be the same thing, right?
SPEAKER_00And the images you align with it embedded in the brain that you know one must lead to the other, could become the other. Whether or not it does, it's always an imminent possibility.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's really interesting. You should say that too, because if you're thinking about like even radio marketing, there's something called visual or visual imaging or visually train, I'm sorry, imagery transfer. And so when you're thinking about that, that's exactly what that means. Like, I could I could just through my radio voice describe describe if I were a male, because I wouldn't as a female, but like maybe the most beautiful woman, right, in the world. And somebody's view of that is going to be different than what somebody else is going to view without seeing that image specifically. That's right.
SPEAKER_00You keep it just vague enough so they can tailor it to themselves and try and blend.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So the framing is important, right? So again, that you know, if you're saying protest, riot, demonstration, or whatever, that all can create different emotional meanings for different people, depending on what they visualize. So, or even if they see it. Also, the second is placement. So in old media where a story aired mattered, right? The lead story, kicker, you know, let's tease the top of the hour, below the fold, below the fold is on an internet term, right? In social placement is now about feed priority, right? The trending tabs, the search results, you know, recommendation systems and like what is getting you clipped. Those are the things now that really matter, right? And so it's different because you know, you got to make sure that it's trending that high that it's gonna be seeing repetition to me is always the biggest because people underestimate how much repetition, apologize, shapes belief, right? So in media, if a phrase is repeated enough, it it kind of starts to feel like it's common knowledge. And we see this happening through propaganda and everything else all the time. So also the fourth would be like again, borrowed credibility. It's another one I'd give you is borrowed credibility because if you put something next to a trusted voice, and we used to call these endorsements, right? A serious graphic, maybe it's like a dramatic government source, a medical expert, a uniform for God's sakes, or even like some legacy logo, and that audience will just process it differently. It's really crazy. Last two would be emotional sequencing. So, like, you know, you hit fear, then anger, then certainty, right? That is that's how you keep attention, and it's it's disturbing to watch as the news media has used this now inside of content or news or what should be news, which is now really just entertainment, versus how we were using it in advertising. So you're seeing like, you know, where you where you hit that fear first and anger and uncertainty, and people start to believe what they're hearing, and it's very dangerous. At the same time, it can also work effectively for advertising. The final one I would say is probably social proof, right? And everyone is really talking about social proof. Uh the internet is is is pretty furious right now. Experts say that you know the critics are blasting, right? Critics are blasting. I know. These phrases, right? These phrases make people feel like there's a consensus that's already built.
SPEAKER_00And again, I mean, affordability is basically Toyota Thon. You know what I mean? But it's easy, it rolls off the tongue.
SPEAKER_03No, you're right, you're right. So marketing doesn't always tell people like what to think, but a lot of the time it's telling people what emotional category they should put it in. And I think that that is a very powerful media trick. And it's it's not lying, but it is assigning your emotional frame before before you can actually, as a person or as an audience, get the facts. So I think if you're using that in your advertising, it'll work for you for sure.
SPEAKER_00Plus, you've got this great excess of overlap of lies by omission or co-mission, you know, either flood the square with quasi-distracting two truths and lie crap, or just casually leave out something that's right in front of your face until everyone thinks that it doesn't matter. I mean, think about it. It I did this in Louisiana, right? Before Marty got because I came from New York. People are very uppity up here, but down there I thought, fuck it, let's go all the way in. So I would just casually walk down the street, not even, you know, the French quarter, just casually walk down the street in like a governor's wig and a bathrobe, right? Just for shits and giggles. And when you start to interact with people and you talk with them normally and you completely act like you're not doing anything weird at all, don't even draw attention to it. Just what are you wearing? Oh no, just uh a nice outfit for the weather. It's a little cold outside. You know, you watch them kind of just slowly fight with themselves on a subconscious level of am I am I the crazy one? You know, it's it's very it's fun, it's it's like drinking Gatorade, like it's not illegal.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's not. And and and I guess too, you know, there's another thing I would I'd mention too, is that you know, going back to the repetition, it it ties really to branding, right? And it's a word we don't hear as much anymore, but you you always have to, you know, see it so many times or hear it so many times to have that brand repetition. That's where really where the word comes from. And I used to always do this trick with people, like not a trick, but just a little game with with people I was working with to build campaigns. And I would ask them, like, you know, like as we're thinking about, you know, where we want to be and how important branding is. Like, if you were to sit here and try to name as quickly as possible, like within five seconds, as many fast food restaurants as you possibly can, it gets more and more difficult as time goes on. I mean, you're gonna hit the big ones first, but then you're gonna start reaching to try to name other actual fast food restaurants, or you know, could be mattress companies, could be, you know, software drinks. And it's really because our brains are meant, they're almost like a filing cabinet, right? So you have a folder for every category that's that exists. And if you reach inside your category and you're like, I need, I need, you know, the first name of a mattress company that comes to my mind, you're gonna reach in there and you can only really hold three to five. That's usually what people can hold from a branding standpoint in their brain when they're trying to remember a brand. It gets really hard after that. So it's extremely important that you have enough repetition to be at the top of the folder, right? To be to be the first in the folder, or at least within this top five. Because if you're not, there's you have no brand recognition whatsoever.
SPEAKER_00This is what I'm constantly driving home, right? Because you've got media literacy is now as important as critical thinking because you got to know where to look, how to adjust for tone, how to adjust for markets, all those things. But lateral thinking is becoming even more important because all those filing cabinets are bleeding over and you can't hold that partition. Unless you can learn to approach all of them in real time, you're not gonna be able to manage them in the pressure that you're under, regardless of whether it's social or personal or whatever may have you. I mean, this is why take TikTok. I'll put up a vague prompt and say something like, What's your stance on this and why are you wrong? to see if people can actually do a flip and use their own thinking against themselves to justify a counter-argument. And they very seldom, if ever, do.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's true. It is true. Good point. All right. Probably most of my I have a lot of tricks, but probably way more than the whole thing. Oh, like like things in the backside that like most people aren't aren't really familiar with. You mean?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, give us all the fun stuff.
SPEAKER_03You're throwing out all the interesting ones. Uh, I mean, I think a lot of people have no idea how a newsroom is even run. I mean, they have all these ideas, right? From what they've seen on TV, but it's not even relatively there's some relevance to it, but it's it's is so much more than that, right? I mean, let's let's talk about both sales and news because obviously, you know, I I've crossed paths with every department, like not even cross paths, I've had to wear hats in every department.
SPEAKER_00But are you saying Anchorman isn't a documentary? Dorothy Melchizedek is a saint.
SPEAKER_03It's terrible documentary. No, it's not that it's terrible. I think what's great about Anchorman, and then I'll answer the question, is that uh I think that, you know, from that timestamp, okay, if you're going back in time, that was it was relatively close, at least, to the masculinity issue that was sitting inside of the newsroom. And I and I hate to say that, but it is true. It was definitely a man's world, okay, for sure. And I think they got that part 100% accurate, right? They did get some scenes correct too, like as far as a sense of urgency and uh, you know, the battles between, of course, they weren't obviously over the top like that between the the uh that that they took it way too far, but there are definitely, you know, I guess some issues between competing news organizations, right? For sure. And and what used to be, and I hear some of the background, we'll go into it now. Like if you were if you were going out, and this will kind of lead into a little bit of how things change too, but I'll try not to go too deep in that for you. Yet it's interesting because like if you're out in the street, you used to send all of your stations, all the stations in the market would go directly to whoever was reporting. So say you had some major thing happening at the courthouse, right? Every single news station and market would go out with their station truck, with their, you know, photogs, which were videographers or whatever we called them both. They would go out and you would have them out there with their beta cams, right? And their and their cords wired up to a to a reporter, and they would all get the story, right? That actually changed. And a lot of people don't even realize this. And it's crazy when I tell you a lot of people are gonna go, what the hell? Now, a lot of markets have create hubs, joint partnerships, which back in the 90s would have never happened, okay? Because of the competition stage, kind of similar to what you're talking about with with the anchor man. They would go out and send one crew out. That crew would record all of the B-roll, all of the press conference, right? And then they would send it back and they would send it out to every of all the news stations. That's that's what has changed, which is it's good use. You're seeing that now in a lot more markets where they don't send out a single truck to these locations. They're working together as a hub with the entire market, even though they're competing. It's crazy, big change. Also, you know, talking about the kind of stuff in market. I mean, oh god, I'm I'm aging myself somewhat by saying this, but I mean, I do remember, I remember times like I was there and I've talked about this, you know, on TikTok. I I was there when you know we got the fax, you know, because everything comes across what we call the wire. The wire is basically a fax machine, right? It comes differently now. It can still come across the fax, but it can also come via email because things have just evolved, right? But it comes across and as soon as it hits the newsroom, you know, they'll grab it, they'll take it to the assignment desk or to the news to the news director, whichever, depending on the size of the story, right? And uh, and then they'll feed it out, right? And uh, you know, I was there in the newsroom the day that um that that Michael Jackson died. And uh, you know, just again, this will give you kind of a clue into some of the things we do behind the scenes. We did we held the story for a while. Like we obviously broke the story, but we we we had a feeling already or kind of knew. I'm gonna I'm gonna say it like that. We already knew he was dead. But one thing that happens within newsrooms is sometimes I'm just under, you know, the guise of wanting to slow roll the public, right? We don't always release everything right at once because sometimes you need to soften the blow. That happened in our newsroom when that story broke, and it and it happened across America as well. Everyone was very reluctant to say what we already knew, and we already knew it was dead. And so they're there, and that's done by design. I think uh also people don't know what you know that that media stations can preempt programming, right? So you can preempt programming, they understand that you can preempt it, but they don't understand that you only get so many credits from the network in order to do that because you have your O's or your owned and operated. You also have your your you know affiliate stations who are just affiliates and they usually have major ownerships behind them. And sometimes you'll have a company that owns you know both companies, right? So I mean I've worked in radio and TV and and I've worked around print and around digital, right? And and some of these companies have both, you know, all of it. They have all of it under their umbrella. And I think that when we were looking back at at the programming side and programming what people don't realize is you get so many credits. Like if you're an affiliate you get so many credits a year to preamp stuff. So say you want to run a special programming right and you're going to run some event in the night or whatever or a movie or whatever. You get so many credits to to not run the programming from the network. And at that point, if you don't run the programming then you're charged a fee if you bypass the number of credits you actually have, right? People don't realize that they also don't know that if you place commercial spots, like unless you're running ads, you don't really know this. But if you're placing ads in TV and you run commercial load what we come commercial load that that you could be preempted just because of how much you paid for your for your spot somebody could come in pay more and bump you out. And people don't really realize that unless you're running ads in TV they don't they don't realize that and it gets so it's like an auction. It is actually and it gets like a hundred times worse during during uh political runs right during political the amount of money coming in is enormous enormous and sometimes you can have like you know 80 to 100,000 preemption day where that means you just basically offloaded a hundred grand and commercial ads off of your books in a single day because you were outbid by by by ads for politics. And that is uh really disturbing actually because nobody wants to think that with all the political ads that are running that you know they're costing millions of dollars this is why it's happening because they're buying up spots and space so so quickly that they're having to pay top dollar for it.
SPEAKER_00So let me ask you if we if we take your you know your average genuine silent majority that are Americans that don't overindulge in politics or anything they work whatever they work come home take care of their kids their family their what whatever they got going on right and they turn on the news could be any station are there any types of I don't know hand signals or camera shifts or anything that goes on while they're watching that that they could look out for if there's like subtle conversation even if it's just for production that might happen in real time during the news there is but a lot of times they're not going to see it.
SPEAKER_03You're not gonna see it most of that stuff is happening behind the camera to the crew on set usually the crew will not do that. Although look am I gonna lie and say that there haven't been occasional situations where there's been slips oh there have been slips but generally you you won't really see that you you're not meant to see that I mean one thing is just some things to watch and and again this is so minute I mean normally you'll see more of that from like the weather in the sports guys you won't see it necessarily from the anchors yeah I don't I just there's not a really easy way to answer that. There are some things that I'm thinking of but I don't think that they're even important enough to mention do you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00Go for it. Those are the best parts you know like Maddie told us about how to look for where someone looks or you know how their their body language or jugular moves like the the type of minutia the unspoken well that's kind of what I was going to say are always fascinating.
SPEAKER_03That's kind of what I was going to say right is uh is there's always tells when you look at the anchors, right? Just by the read um you can tell if they're prepped, if they're not prepped for what they're about to say, if they are playing with their papers, for example, if they you know smack their papers down, they're done. If they play like they're we're just used to this right that's kind of a tell we see all the time if they if they are if they're if they look like they're stalling sometimes it's not even them it's actually because somebody has not uh maybe there's an issue with the uh the prompter or there's an issue with the chroma key we've seen chroma key issues happen like a lot right where the inside of inside of that they that's happened but but honestly I mean other than the psychological things you kind of talk about which are you know not really my necessarily background but I do recognize them where yeah you'll see people look away uncomfortably during a story you can tell that there's sometimes tension on a on a set between reporters or or anchors sometimes just in the way they they will turn their body or shift their chair and but honestly most of these people have worked together for a really long time so you get pissed at each other you move on and you just do the show it's a show and if you don't then you'll get fired. And so it's not it's not as bad as you'd think I think the psychological point that what you were referring to is common in every industry not just in media. Do you know what I mean? Right but I mean the news anchors still have their own you know broadcasting radio voice type deal like corporate has their you know oh we'll circle back to this it's not synergetically aligned or you know oh my god hi how are you in customer service there's always that yeah I think I think though it it's it's it's not as easy because it depends on the anchor right and every anchor has their own tells when you're not getting the rest of the story it's usually because we just don't know the rest of the story right really but it's not because there's necessarily anything being hidden. That happened anything that is happening truthfully before that is I mean that you think is happening that's in relation to there being some kind of hidden tell is happening before it ever hits the newsroom like before it ever hits the anchor desk. It's happening in the newsroom before it hits the anchor desk. And I think that's kind of where those things happen. That's why I said they're going to be off camera you're not gonna see it. When the anchors go in they are just literally going in and reading the news many of them unless they're doing some type of a series breakout and they have their own programming that is locked in for a segment they haven't actually done a ton of research they've skimmed the report they've looked at it and they basically go up there and they look good they come out of the green room look good go straight to the anchor desk and just read do you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00So they don't necessarily that level of simplicity I'm assuming that you know the more complicated things like you see at auctions or in Congress with you know hand motions and and tie code and color code don't much kick in.
SPEAKER_03Well reporters are different from anchors right so so the reporters are a whole different thing. The reporters that are out in the field that is a whole different ballgame like I said because they're they're actually the ones that are going out I wouldn't even call them investigative journalists anymore really because most of them are going out to a story that's already been built for them. It's not it's not really an investigation but there are still investigative journalists out there which are amazing. I just think when they go out and in some cases like we see the funniest things. I mean like you know we we you know you see wind you know that there's going to be a problem with the mic right like they're gonna have issues because you know what's on the other side of the reporter and that is again it used to be a wire right running right off of them directly up because that mic plugs right into that mic which is right into the uh beta cam, I mean, which is exactly why like during the press conference up in Washington when they were there and the shooter was there, right? And you saw that one person actually kind of take a dive they literally were still attached to the mic and it was the guy we we laughed about it kind of for days he he stood up there and he's he actually went to adjust his tie. He removed the mic because you can't run with a mic attached to you you're gonna end up either pulling the beta cam directly out of the the photogs or the videographer's hands or you're gonna end up you know you know pull just uh snatching it out and it breaking he took off the mic and then fixed his tie and we could not stop laughing about that because we're like dude you're there's gunshots happening like that what are you doing? Yeah take the mic off and freaking run right but but so you know there's things like that you can tell it's it happened so much more what you were referring to in a situation with a reporter than you'd ever see in the newsroom because in the newsroom it's it's already prepped for you but out in the street in the field that's different because of course in the field anything can happen right and you can just look at them again it comes down to psychological if if something surprises them you're gonna see it you're gonna see it on film if it's recorded. If uh if they're nervous about something if they've made a state a mistake you'll see it good reporters are great at covering up but it's not easy to covety cover up something when it's happening to you and I think that was a really good example about what happened there at the White House of how that happens right gunshots in the background nobody is going to act not shocked do you know what I mean? Yeah and so but it's not it's not I think there's not like a huge like industry tell if you will do what I mean so just real quick before we move into the comparative portion of you know your private sector work versus the the more traditional legacy media versus your your TikTok recultivation is there anything you want to give a shout out to any podcasts that you've made or programs that you run or the war table you run on TikTok anything you'd like I mean you know we run the Global Situation Room at 8 p.m eastern every night on TikTok under Marine Mom you know that other than that no I mean I I obviously now my world is pretty much still media I still work in the media attached to we'll say that attached to the media because I still work with the media I still work with clients after I left the media I started working within you know agency business and also of course worked directly with a lot of launches new launches and of course you know people that were have longstanding you know large businesses in America and uh you know I I don't want to name any because I don't want to ever dox myself but but of course you know I uh I've worked with some very big players and so worked with you know accounts that are 500 000 you know earners all the way up to like you know multi-billion you know what I mean earners and and so ultimately I've seen it all and I always say like it doesn't matter big or small like for whether you're a small business or you're a multi-million dollar business whatever money you have is is your money you worked hard for it it's important and uh so I never treat them differently so that is always one rule of thumb that I have always learned because uh it doesn't really matter it's still somebody's livelihood no matter how much you're making and so I think that you know I have since moving into that sector obviously I have focused a lot of time as you know on because you know of my son being a US Marine I focus a lot of time on you know the backside of my my my educational career which of course fell into political science and focused really heavily of course on on what's going on around wartime strategy and of course around you know counterterrorism threats and and things like that. So specifically heavily into the Middle East and so I I spent a lot of time doing that now in my free time we'll say we'll call it free time.
SPEAKER_00But anyway you brought that up because there's a question I've been meaning to ask you know a person such as yourself. So obviously the most recent thing is this MOU. And uh I'm just I'm curious how all of the media seems it worldwide and domestic seems to be able to break all of these you know explanations of what's in the MOU. A lot of them don't line up but the State Department hasn't released a damn thing except for the MOU on nuclear development with you know the Dominican Republic yesterday that people seem to keep mixing up so how is the media able to do that? Is that not some type of uh misrepresentation?
SPEAKER_03Yes and no I I I think that they are being leaked out very little information. Um and I think that's by design in this case especially I've noticed that this administration has leaned in my opinion has leaned very heavy on Axios. There's there's always usually one or two that the administration will feed out like what what we call the uh the soft the soft news right the the soft the softening we'll call it the softening right because basically if you're gonna release something that's going to be a shock you you want to kind of roll it out slowly. So Axios seems to be the one that I have seen so far that Mrs. this administration has used a lot they've also used Fox of course but Fox seems to get the bigger story right like the the they get the solid like this is the story. Axios seems to be doing the slow roll and uh and I I can tell you that I keep I keep watching Axios. So like whenever Axios releases something I I cross reference it a lot with other media points I'm seeing to see if anybody else has it right. So when you're dealing with stuff like the MOU specifically I'm always checking international media because they may not be playing the exact same game although in this case the IRGC was playing a game because they actually were trying they asked us they asked the US not to release the actual true text of the MOU and you know it's come to my attention as of yesterday part of this reason is is because they're framing it and this is going to probably tick you off they're framing this as a a memorandum of understanding between the United States president and the president of Iran. Now that's very he's not even real don't get me started that's an entire other conversation but they're framing it as that because of course that means that they're not accepting of the actual mo in itself because their own president I mean their own supreme leader allegedly is the one that is saying this so that it's being framed this way meaning that they're not and remember if you remember like a week or two ago there were some things coming some rumblings coming out of the out of the Middle East that Pazeskian who happens to be the president who is the one that signed was kind of at odds with the the hardliners within side of the IRGC.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03So this is why I find this to be a bit of a problem. So as far as the media I think the media is basically they're gonna if they have information boy they are going to leak the information. So I think this administration has tiptoed that now to answer your question in a different way because I know what you're looking for and I think it's really important many times let's take the MOU out of this because I think that this is an oddity in this sense. Most of the time if if if there's information from the media that they don't want you to know they're not gonna let you know it. And and are there some directives I believe there are because you know I have firsthand seen you know from and people don't understand this part when you have a left leaning organization and this does not mean and and I I this is kind of a bit of a trap because people will say well Israel owns all this in the media no they don't okay that that is actually not true.
SPEAKER_00You may have a person for example who is a shareholder right sure there are shareholders all over the place in the media right but the ownership is what is really who owns the company and what are their what are their directives and I can tell you predominantly backfunded by dark soft power from Europe of all fucking things who's mostly state owned media because if you look at you know the UK for example you have to pay a TV tax because it comes with the BBC built in like a lot of people are not accounting for the fact that right you know when you look at foreign media if it's state owned it's gonna be the literal government directly twisting a narrative and whether they like or dislike the United States will shape how so I mean the people who came here from Europe right for all these great sporting events they they were just a lot of them were confused as hell because they thought we were on fire. They thought the world was ending and now they know why we're fat because they tried our it's true.
SPEAKER_03It's true I I think that this is one of the best examples of where Murray media is at today because it is being so propagandized. And uh so in that sense yes I would agree with you that you know the MOU is such an oddity but in this case here what you're mentioning 100% accurate they will keep things they will shift the narrative I think the best example of this I can give you is back during the elections just before the elections actually do you remember when the situation came up regarding FEMA and of course the potential funds right through that yeah I I'm trying to remember the name of the the shared plan but I think it was like the uh oh it's gonna skip my mind anyway between Jean Pierre and Scaramucci two ends of a very horrifying monster well so this was in in reference to the uh the money that was being used for the immigration and from FEMA that there was such a concern about anyway I was talking to a member of Trump's campaign and I had found this piece of information I sent it to him it had a lot of data in it that was proving kind of what we later saw come from Matt Gates. So I sent it to them privately and they told me we already have it right it was actually an embedded onto so if you imagine you're you're on the a FEMA site and you don't have an actual live link. So it's basically a unlisted link an unlisted file on the account yeah so this was an unlisted file I had found on the FEMA site and uh I found it with the help of some other creators which I'm not going to name because I don't want to pull them out here but I wasn't the one that originally found it but we found it they found it passed it to me.
SPEAKER_00What type of people are on TikTok outside of your standard crazies for dance and skid sap there's a lot of very uh talented people with unique specializations on IPQRIS one for every 500 irritating morons that have cost me my hair.
SPEAKER_03Yep so so we found this right they found it they passed it to me they didn't really know what it was I figured out what it was kind of I went and got it to the administration. So they they knew about it already they didn't have the file but they knew about the scenario already they told me through an entire thread that like I I would not believe what else that that this that obviously the the Biden administration had done. And uh anyway what was interesting was they said listen you know Matt Gates is going to address this today and they sent me the press release two hours before the press release came out. So I had the press release and I was talking about this press release that was going to come out this is the most perfect example I can give you of how sickening full of propaganda our media actually is now today. And and literally within within five minutes of it dropping so it drops two hours later we're watching it because we know it's going to drop and within five minutes every major news organization around the United States had the same story already ready to go. And Biden made a statement within an hour and it matched I I was I can tell you and this is the truth I had never felt more sick to my stomach just to see how far that we had changed from the time I had left when it was already getting bad to the time that I saw that happen I I I was very disgusted.
SPEAKER_00Well I mean one of the things that's really changed with media for your your standard onlooker right and that's why I wrote the Codex Politica so people could cross reference things and be wary of it and form their own opinions but you don't see a lot of redactions anymore. You don't see a lot of people linking you to the actual treasury report when they want to misrepresent it. You know they don't really tell you like for example right if you've got a left leaning source taking a piece of a bill and saying this is egregious this is awful you've got a right leaning source taking a piece of a bill saying this is egregious this is awful fuck both of them go to congress.gov and read it put in shall in the dollar sign get down to the nitty gritty don't use AI right because the five chapters and the AI are also kind of cross funded with some of the legacy it's a whole fucking barrage of what the hell but you don't see a lot of those call those course corrections a lot of those redirections it's like you said just the the repetition of this narrative except now it's coming from the left the right and every other source in a hundred different ways to say the same thing.
SPEAKER_03Yeah I mean it it's really crazy. I mean I think I don't think journalism even fell off because the journalists became evil I've never felt that in fact that's what kind of made me leave the industry I I I knew it wasn't that I knew where it was the ownerships. And I think the incentives changed. I mean, the newsroom did get smaller. It really did. The corporate pressure got a lot bigger. And I think the audiences have gotten more fragmented, you know what I mean, over time, which makes it very difficult for them to manage the operation in the same sense because journalism journalism did not die like in one scandal, right?
SPEAKER_00Right. It was the Substack covers all the legal and the corporate interventions dating all the way back to the Telegraph Act and you know how we kind of got here. I actually really want to hear your thoughts on that when you get a chance to read it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, I think it's slowly, I think journalism did journalism didn't die in one scandal. I think it was slowly converted from a public trust model into an attention economy model. And I think that's what shifted. I mean, that, and of course, you know, the the switcheroo with the whole entire uh what do you call it? The people people always refer to the Smith Munt Act, but it was much worse than that. I mean, the the real issue started, of course, with the uh the telecommunications act, right?
SPEAKER_00Yep, and then the fairness doctrine, the NDAS, and it just it kept compiling the what was it called? The Bell, the Bell Axe that redisseminated distribution. Like it's been a long time in the making to get to this point.
SPEAKER_03It has. It has. And I mean, and we watched, you know, it it's just it's very tragic because when we were getting gobbled up, I mean, and I've been there, I was literally being sold, I hate to say that word, but working for one news organization, being sold to another solely because they didn't want people to have too many, you know, stations, right? But what happened was they manipulated it because they would they would take those companies and roll them under a different name and still have ownership, right? It just on paper it looked good, right? And that wasn't the way it was supposed to be. And so, you know, that caused a problem. This is how you've ended up with so many, because when they did this in in television and everywhere else, it actually affected radio. And you're and you're you see these like George Soros now owning over 200 radio stations.
SPEAKER_00I mean, shit, iHeartRadio One Belt Road Initiative, and they don't have to say that they're Chinese. So when they put out you know stories like hate your neighbor, they're gay, straight, black, white, democrat, republican, people assume it's coming from an American source, and it's not a good chunk of the time, it's not.
SPEAKER_03No, it's it's it's really true. I mean, it's really true. I I think that uh, you know, watching watching uh, you know, like companies like iHeartRadio with over like 1100, I think it is now, some crazy 800 or 1100 stations, that shouldn't be happening. I mean, I hate to say it, but it shouldn't happen. And uh, you have so much uh venture capitalism money shoved into these ownerships, it's almost repetitious. People have no idea. Like every so many years, they have to turn around and fire a bunch of people, reduce their debt, you know what I mean? And then they rehire a bunch of people just to, you know, get the loan. Um, it's crazy as it comes due. And it's been happening like this for decades now.
SPEAKER_00I mean, the the one that really just irked every one of my, you know, proverbial feathers here was I'd say the last decade or so, maybe every year, every two years, you see damn near every legacy media source left, right, or sideways, and regardless of who owns it, come out and tell you about the dangers of doing your own research and how you should trust us, and you can mislead yourself into the what the fuck? Right.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean, I so I don't I don't want to say that journalism was ever perfect either.
SPEAKER_00So there was some degree of integrity, even if it was formalized and then eroded.
SPEAKER_03There was. I mean, I guess with the business incentives that were happening and the regulation changes and the all the ownership consolidations, you know, the newsroom cuts, also the 24-hour cable, because that was a whole thing, right? I mean, if you look at the fair doctrine, the fairness doctrine, which you mentioned, and I think that's a great point. I mean, it required broadcasters, right, to cover all the controversial public issues and present the contrasting viewpoint. But that doesn't happen all the time anymore, right? We don't hear the contrasting viewpoint, which it's become entertainment for this very reason. You also had the rise of the cable and the 24-hour news pressure, right? And it's funny because I would correlate the 24-hour news pressure to what we're seeing now with social media or what we've, yeah, I would completely. Once the news like had to fill every hour, right? Every day, there was like a need for more panels, more speculation, you know, more breaking news banners, more emotional packaging, which we talked about earlier, and the personality-driven coverage, right? Like that had to happen. And then, you know, you had the Telecommunications Act, which I was talking about, which truthfully, look, it was a major overhaul that was definitely intended to let these communication companies compete in any market. But it actually, in practice, it accelerated all the colon, you know, consolidation, especially in radio with these, you know, and the and the broader media ownership debates, right? And the public interest concern at that point were there were fewer owners, and that would meant to fewer local voices thinner coverage, right? And and honestly, it backfired. Um, and then when the internet kind of pushed its way in, it it absolutely crushed the news, the print stuff. The internet crushed print. And uh that was sad to see.
SPEAKER_00I'm not gonna lie, because that was young around in a garage and bullshit each other anymore because someone could just Google it and make run into all the fun.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that was that was it was. I mean, as even though I like we all saw it was a dying vessel, I mean, we we all still kind of weeped for our sister, right? We were like, God, this sucks for them.
SPEAKER_00I mean, Trent was really even if you look at some of the National Archives, you know, old New York Times articles or old, you know, whatever insert blank articles, you'd see that they were disseminating newspapers on the same date that were worded differently pertaining to events in different areas. And you know, now that we have the ability to look back at it, it's just oh, they were always playing both sides.
SPEAKER_03100%. And you know, like I was talking about how the cable news pressure, the 24-hour news pressure, how it was it was reminiscent of social. Listen, I'm gonna tell you right now, the social media has turned journalism into a freaking traffic war. It has. I mean, you've got the anchors, the freaking reporters, even commentators now are all competing for the same attention marketplace.
SPEAKER_00Sorry, Maria, can you move that up for just a second?
SPEAKER_03Yeah. You're okay.
SPEAKER_00So, you know, we we talk about social media, but you really have to look at the reality that we've shifted from this fixed social media, you know, people jumped from Tom and My Space to Facebook to Instagram. Now everyone's on TikTok. And the marketing was always there, right? The color coding, the gamification, the the slow roll into groups and and all these paradigms. But TikTok is uniquely horrifying to me because it has all these things and it can also build an algorithm around you, like you said, where you get repetition from every direction, right? And in real time, it will show you the happiest video that you've ever seen, then the saddest, then the most terrifying until you're emotionally numb. And it kind of puts you into that suggestive state that if you don't step away from the algorithm, it will it will absolutely, absolutely screw with your head. And I think it's really dangerous to have this the way that it is, shifting from you know marketing, which is capitalism, just gamify it to messaging, right? Because whoever puts the most in can shift the narrative and and drill that into people's heads. It really is so. If you look at psychic driving, and I don't want to use this too, literally, let's take it colloquially. You've got a huge chunk of the population that are either on uppers, downers, or some type of diet meth, right? You've got all these things built into TikTok to keep you from sleeping or to keep you in a suggestive state with this hyper-emotional boxing like you were talking about, and it's all happening in real time. Yeah, I just I don't I don't like the way it's developing. It I think it's gonna be very dangerous if people don't learn media literacy, how to source things. Like what what tips or or tricks would you provide? I guess. Well, in general, I like to leave the audience with, you know, advisement, let's say, from people who have specialized in certain fields, like how would you get things to the news? How would you sort through news? What would you look for? You know, all that type of stuff.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and I I totally get that. I I don't disagree with you. I mean, I think that I think the real reason that we saw so much change with social media is is really based upon, you know, the fact that it didn't it didn't change because people like suddenly became worse, right?
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03It changed because the incentive systems changed in every platform. Like people, you know, one time it was just people thoughtfully posting, right? But then the platforms built these machines that rewarded behavior because if it was a calm post, a thoughtful post like you saw on Facebook previously, you didn't really make as much money or you didn't get as many followers. So, but the outrage and like all the panic and drama and the fights and shit, that is where people started seeing this massive, like you know, reward. And it was kind of crazy because the old model was like, okay, show me how show me the people I follow or how many people I follow. And now it's like if there's not outrage or like instant gratification of some in some way that drives your emotion to your point, then you're bored with it. And that pretty much is.
SPEAKER_00The regulation systems are just absolutely disgusting. I mean, I've I I know we've both been, you know, nailed with a restriction for low quality content when we're going into the nitty-gritty of something important. It's like, oh, I'm sorry I'm not, you know, calling this person a troglodite and screaming at them and feeding your real housewives of TikTok bullshit, but fuck off.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I I I a hundred percent agree. I mean, what's also weird too is now that social media it changed because like the platforms all became advertising companies. They did. Every one of them became ad companies, and uh that's weird, right? They weren't just social media platforms anymore. Now you can sell ads, you can sell attention, like what we talked about in the beginning. That's really the key to all of it is selling attention. So that attention that we're talking about could be emotional and it drives you, and the more attention or emotion you have, or the more emotion you have, the more attention you have. So I think that uh it the the means really that the user is not really your customer, they're the advertiser is the customer, which is really strange.
SPEAKER_00But that is also reshaping, you know, vernacular because God, thank God, you know, us old people made urban dictionary so we can follow what the hell is going on, right? But at the same time, I said pew pew to a veteran one day off the app, and I went, I'm not fucking doing this ever again. Went and read the DSA reports, went and read the transparency reports, terms of service, and found every little niche thing I needed to do to be able to say gun. And now I just let it fly because I'm not gonna let them change.
SPEAKER_03It's ridiculous. Here's the easiest way I can say this the old internet connected people, right? The new shit we see now triggers people. That's literally all it does. And I agree with you. I I think it's disturbing, and unfortunately, you're right, there's not a strong regulated oversight. And the problem is is do you want that? At what point does that like reduce your free speech? That that's kind of where the problem comes in from a constitutional standpoint, right? How much regulation do we want to give the government into our ability to tell each other what's really happening?
SPEAKER_00You know what? Fuck it. TikTok pissed me off enough to just do this on the episode. So in reading the DSA reports, right, TikTok's own transparency reports, they released them yearly, biannually in some instances, with like the uh the advanced accounting reports, for example, right? All public knowledge, by the way. It's on their website, they're legally mandated to. But they openly say that they sold targeted censorship to foreign nations in some instances, in some instances to our own government, right? So you think about these old dinosaurs on the congressional floor screaming about Facebook and thinking that you know we we all joked about this, especially people like Bit of Prophet on TikTok, right? You know, that they don't know what questions to ask, they don't know what the hell is going on, they're just these disconnected old fucks, right? But at the same time, now that it is backfunded by not just ours, but foreign governments, at what point does that trip, you know, one, six, and say nine into a mass suitable offense to say, hey, this is bullshit, and this is an attack by you know foreign governments on my free speech. This is an excess of I'm trying to remember the act that allowed it to disappear. Now you're the concept.
SPEAKER_03Now you're falling into the Smith Munt Act.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I'm just gonna look. I I I think it's gonna be really hard to get the government, and I'm just gonna say it like it is, it's gonna be very hard to get the dub difficult to get the dub to get the government, very difficult to get the government to actually move on unpeeling away like all this these layers.
SPEAKER_00You think they'd at least be fine.
SPEAKER_03But I want you to think about something. Like you asked me earlier about the private sector, okay? Like just think about this and think about government while I say it. Like, because in the private sector, we were always asking, like, who is the audience and what do they care about? What problem are we solving, and like what emotion moves them to act, right? And the problem is the media and the government started doing the same fucking thing, like instead of selling a product, they started selling an identity or fear or outrage, message, yeah. Yes, and so how do you make them stop now? Because they're at the point where they don't want to.
SPEAKER_00I don't think we can. I think the best thing to do, like the best course I ever took in college was media literacy. It was an offshoot course at the very last year, and it really walked me through what to look for and what not to as a tell to be like, okay, well, this is clearly bullshit. What do I cross-reference? I mean, people still believe peer review is real, Maureen.
SPEAKER_03Well, look, the average person doesn't need a journalism degree. They really just need pattern recognition, don't they? If every story makes you angry in the exact same direction, like you're probably not being informed, like you're probably being conditioned. And that's where people don't recognize the manipulation, right? Because you're first manipulated, like, right? The first sign that you're being manipulated is when the content is telling you what to feel before it actually gives you enough facts to think about it. And I think that we see this every day across every single media that we are touched by.
SPEAKER_00Did you ever watch The Simpsons back in the old days?
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Remember that episode with the media with liminal, super liminal, and and subliminal messaging and the subliminal was that on that niage song. And someone goes, Okay, I get subliminal, I get liminal. What's super liminal? And the guy just walks over to a strange, hey you join the Navy.
SPEAKER_03Okay, yeah. Yes, yes. Always comes. Exactly right. No, it's uh it's it's interesting. I mean, I I am very concerned about where we'll be in in 20 or 30 years if something is not done, but I also am also very worried, like to my point earlier, about too much oversight by our federal government into our ability to break through their own clutter, right? Which we are able to do on apps like TikTok, but it comes with the good and the bad, right? So you have to listen to a lot of fucking bullshit, a lot of nonsense at the same time that you're actually trying to truly understand what's actually happening around you. I don't watch the news at all anymore. I'm sure you probably don't either.
SPEAKER_00Oh, no, no, no. My my father does, you know. I adore him and I I understand he believes people want to come from a good place, but I sit down and and even the local news, it's like for fuck's sake, pivot to an old man feeding the ducks. Like every other word after you start reading the cabinet briefings is just like holy shit. Just just oh my god. No, I break the TV if I watch it every day of my own accord.
SPEAKER_03It's true. I mean, local news to some extent can still be somewhat helpful just to know what's going on around you. But outside of that, I mean, everything else is being fed, and it's it's everything from the the TV programming to the radio programming that is not.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, that was that was the worst of it because there's two things that I'm willing to wait for, right? Books. I'm still waiting on Patrick Ruffloss, you know, 11 years later, release the doors of stone, you fucking prick. And you know, I waited for Veilguard, I was a Dragon Age guy, Inquisition was tremendous. Veilguard drops, the whole fucking thing is propagandized political crap, and I'm just sitting there like, I waited 10 years, yeah, for y'all to piss in my face on the one thing I do to not think about politics. Because you know how it is when it's literally your your field and your focus, is every time there's a pause in it, you don't relax, you think, oh shit, what am I missing?
SPEAKER_03It's exactly right. It's exactly right. You wake up every morning and you're like, I'm afraid to look because I'm sure something happened overnight. I mean, especially that we're, you know, behind Europe, but but that's 100% correct. I I I see this everywhere. It doesn't matter what the programming is, the freaking propaganda is just literally intertwined into it, and it's gross. I mean, you can't watch an award show. It started with the award shows where they had some slight flea free reign, but now you're seeing it like it, it's just everywhere. Do you know what I mean? In in just regular air, you know, TV show programming. It's just, it's, it's sad. And then, you know, look, we're past the point of appointment viewing, too. You know, it used to be that you had a specific time, you had to watch your show, there was no DVR, there was no way to get it. And that's the other problem with social media is that it's available for your entertainment, whatever you want it. All you have to do is turn it on. You know what I mean? And uh that is that is part of the problem.
SPEAKER_00I do apologize for all the horrendous background noise everyone in my neighborhood has decided to do everything at the same fucking time, apparently. And I apologize for my co-producer as well, because she's the technomantress and she has to unfuck this. But is there any advice you'd give the good people from your professional standpoint? And then we'll just close it out there.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so like if you're if you're a marketer or you're in a company, a business, you're trying to market your business, always use the three R's, right? The right message to the right audience the right number of times, and and always look at concentration marketing, right? So, concentration marketing, the best analogy I can give you is a lot of advertisers want to take their entire ad budget and pour it into if you picture every single glass, an empty glass of water as a a single media platform, right? It could even be even more in-depth than that. You could go down to if you're looking at radio, day parts, and that could be like a 6A to 10A, 10A to 3P, so on. Most advertisers want to take their full budget, which is the entire pitcher of water, and pour it into multiple glasses, right? And that's not good. Concentration marketing is such a better way to grow your business. That's where you can say, I own something, I own it. And then when you see the return on investment, then you take that return on investment off the top and you drop it into a new glass of water. So the glass of water should represent, of course, a different media platform generally. But say you don't have enough budget to buy ads across, let's say it's radio for an entire day. Okay, and I'm not even suggesting that, but let's just say that that was what we were talking about. It sometimes is better for you to go, okay, well, I can't do that. I don't have enough budget to do that, but I could put a spot or two in every single day in just the morning show, right? So you do that and you hold it there. You continue to spend your budget there consistently with the right message to the right audience, has to be the right audience, and that the right number of times is exactly what I'm referring to. So essentially what happens is you will eventually see a return on investment. And then when you see that return, you take that money and you drop it into another day part until you do the same thing there, and so on and so on. And then you move to another station or you move to TV or whatever, and you continue to build that effect until you do own the market. And that's literally the best way that you can build your business and scale. And it is considered it's what's called concentration marketing. It comes directly from the grandfather of marketing, Peter, Peter, Peter, boy. Now I'm gonna draw a blank too. Drucker. There you go. So that's that's what I would tell you. I think that it's really important to do that and to understand that uh that's the best way to market, in my opinion. Otherwise, all you're doing is uh spreading yourself too thin.
SPEAKER_00Perfect. I I appreciate you coming on today, Marine Mom. Just real quick, just in a quick summation here. Do you trust the media? Hell no. Perfect. Thank you for coming on. As as she said her podcast, uh Mariana, you want to plug it one more time?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so we're on at 8 p.m. Eastern every night with the Global Situation Room under Marine Mom. That's how you find us is Marine Mom, real Marine Mom, actually, on TikTok at 8 p.m. Eastern every night. And uh, and uh that's where that's where you'll find us.
SPEAKER_00Perfect. As always, we're tremendously grateful for our subject matter experts and we appreciate you coming on. I strongly encourage everyone to tune into her live stream. It's a hell of a panel and a wonderful conversation, and typically it's pretty open after the reports to people at any level of education to come in and learn and have real conversations. As always, if you'd like to do the same with us, you can sign up and leave your suggestion, comment, question, recommendation, whatever you may have, and we're happy to hear you. Remember to follow that X and get the Codex Politica and check in on the Privy Council because founders are getting up to some more chicanery with flagacious shrews. Yeah, that'll that'll make sense later. You could grab a copy of the chamber pot and find out for yourself in short order. Appreciate y'all joining us once again. Signing off the House of Goose. Have a great day. Bye.
